First boo-bow. A practice project.

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ppofandt
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First boo-bow. A practice project.

#1 Post by ppofandt » Fri Apr 09, 2010 11:33 am

Heya.

I was an avid (but totally raw) archer as a young kid (It wasn't till years later that I realised I had been stringing my recurve backwards). Fast forward to a mates 40th birthday party where, in our cups we reminisced over the target shooting we used to do (.22 rifles mainly). I mentioned that I'd love to get back into it but not with rifles. Bows seemed a lot more affordable than I remembered and archery might be the way to go. Well. The following year when my 40th rolled around my mate had a gift for me :) Back in to the sport again.

Anyway. Enough background. I love archery and I love working with my hands. Since I found the lively culture of bowmaking, I've been itching to get started in it. Cue a good year or more reading everything I could on the subject - inspecting every build-along I can (ozbow, tradgang), reading the suggestions and tips, perusing kit suppliers (Ausbow, Binghams etc) I ran across an article suggesting that for a beginner, bamboo floorboarding was a good starting material. Make that a few articles. So...

I've tried my hand at making a simple boo-board flatbow. Primarily to start practicing the techniques involved. However, given my point of view and the type of resources I had on, I thought that there may be some value in documenting and sharing the build progress. Mainly so that I can show what I have done so as to solicit critique and suggestions, but also to show what a person with little (read: 'no') experience can do Hopefully to encourage other wanabe bowmakers to just get in and get started (or to point out what not to do - as the case may be).

I'm more than a little self conscious posting my beginner attempt on this site - given the quality of some of the projects I've seen but. Like I said, I'm hoping that there is some value in this post.


Starting resources.
websites:
OzBow - http://www.ozbow.net/phpBB3/
TradGang - http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi
Stickbow - http://www.stickbow.com/features/index. ... owbuilding
How to make bows and staff - http://poorfolkbows.com/

and the post that got me started.

Boo-board bow - http://www.ozbow.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.p ... 96&start=0

Magazines/Books:
Primative Archer magazine - http://www.primitivearcher.com/
The Design and Construction of Composite Long (Flat) Bows by John Clark - http://www.ausbow.com.au/books.html

Supply companies:
Ausbow Industries - http://www.ausbow.com.au/longbows.htm
Bingham Projects - http://www.binghamprojects.com/
Acers Timber Flooring - http://www.acersgrouponline.com/
Acers timber flooring is where I got my boo boards from. They're conveniently just 2 doors over from Eagle Archery in Slacks Creek, SE Qld. The boards, while not the best, were only about $10 each. More on that in a bit.

ppofandt
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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#2 Post by ppofandt » Fri Apr 09, 2010 11:33 am

Getting started:
I sourced a few bamboo floorboards from Acers Timber Flooring in Slacks Creek (SE Queensland - South side of Brisbane). The owner was nice enough to sell me individual boards rather than full packs and they only cost about $10 each. These are vertical bamboo floorboards. Made up from multiple 8mm wide strips laminated together. They are about 1930mm long (75") x 96mm x approx 15mm. Only downside was that they were not flat on the bottom. Rather they had 'channels' cut into them - for want of a better word. Each of the channels was about 1" wide so I'd be able to cut staves from it, some of which would be 15mm thick and others 13mm.

Image

I cut a single stave 1" wide and 66" long

Image

On my circular saw and sanded the varnish off, removed the saw marks and checked that it was square and even.
With the offcuts (thinner stave) I cut 2 x 30mm lengths and glued them together to use as a handle block.
Just a word on gluing. For this project I used Titebond - a high strength PVA based woodworking glue. However this is not what I would consider suitable for a 'real' bow. I DO have nearly 2l of Techniglue on hand but when the time came to use it, I couldn't find the disposable spoons I'd bought for measuring :). Go figure. Anyway. For a practice run, PVA will fill the spot.

Once I had cut the stave I spotted a serious flaw in the wood.

Image
Ordinarily I'd just toss the stave at that point and cut a new one. However - practice run and all.

I cut 2 fadeout curves on the handle block and sanded them till they were smoothly curved and the fadeout tips were thin enough to see light though.

Image
And glued them onto the stave - again with Titebond. I used a G-clamp and 2 spring clamps to clamp the handle block in place (riser block?). I used the fadeout cutoffs along with a few pieces of very springy foam rubber to clamp the fadeouts down firmly.

Image Image
Then sanded it all flat and square again.

ppofandt
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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#3 Post by ppofandt » Fri Apr 09, 2010 11:34 am

Next I cut the limbs to a taper. Starting 190mm out from the center (25mm wide at that point) I tapered the width down to 15mm wide. Cut it roughly using a bandsaw (with lots of dust removal and breathing masks for extra safely) and sanded to the drawn line. From the same point I cut away at the belly so that it tapered from 15mm (at the 190mm point) down to 8mm at the tip. Again; cut wit the bandsaw and sanded flat and smooth.

Image Image

Next I cut a few small nock grooves - 20mm back from the tip at a 45deg. Angle. Just so that I could do a quick tiller check to see that things were not too badly out of whack. That all looked ok so I next reinforced the nock tips with a bit of hardwood I had around. I have no idea what wood it is but I've had it around for ages. I've mostly used it as a small anvil for when I needed something softer than steel. Anyway, I cut a small strip off the side, sanded flat and trimmed two pieces up, and glued them to the tips.

Image

I then shaped the tips and knock groves with a small rat-tailed file.

Image

Once I could get a string onto it (very rough bowstring made up out of plumbers' line) I spent a few minutes checking the tiller (curvature of the limbs). There were a few flat spots so I sanded away a bit of the belly till both limbs curved evenly - not necessarily equally but evenly. No shelfs (flat spots) or hinges (abrupt changes in curve). I laid a few pieces of flat timber along the limbs so that I could see the curvature at those points. As you can see the Right-hand side is slightly weaker than the left. I think I'll work on that issue and weaken the left side a bit.

Image

ppofandt
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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#4 Post by ppofandt » Fri Apr 09, 2010 11:34 am

So. That's the point I'm at now. Now - how to proceed?

I have a few questions at this point.
Finishing.
Obviously it all needs a good sand to polish it off. However, the limbs. Would people recommend shaping them to a D cross section (flat back) or to an oval or leaving them flat?
The riser. For a bow this size, is it worth cutting an arrow shelf? Or just shoot around the riser? Is it worth shaping the riser to fit my hand better or just leave it with a rounded belly?
Sealing. What do people use to seal the wood with? What is readily available?
String. What do people usually do for a string? I've seen a few posts and videos on making Flemish braids and that seems quite do-able. Or would people recommend just buying an off-the-shelf string?

Things I've learnt.
I need to work on my shaping skills a lot more.
I need more and better clamps - lots more spring clamps for a start.
I need some better rasps and files.

Finally - does anyone have any comments on the work so far. Anything I've overlooked? Skills I need to work on?

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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#5 Post by Gringa Bows » Fri Apr 09, 2010 2:06 pm

looks good for your first attemp mate :wink: .........................Rod

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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#6 Post by Bill » Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:12 pm

Very interesting, top job for your effort, I look forward to your completed bow and the further advice you may receive,. for I came across a small box of the boo boards and I'm still trying to make, but I'm also still breaking bows. Thanks for your presentation....................Bill

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woodie
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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#7 Post by woodie » Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:21 pm

Looking good. What poundage are you going for?
I am going to be having a go at a boo board bow as soon as I get the time and backing ti with tas oak. I got a boo board from bunnings that has no finish on it and I think it is 19mm thick, it was about $8.
Anyway good luck, hope it works out for you.
Woodie (Ron)
may your arrows fly straight and true and your limbs return.

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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#8 Post by greybeard » Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:07 pm

Looks good for your first attempt.

You could try cutting laminations and tapering them before gluing up. This method reduces the potential for soft spots as well as allowing the laminations to be offset to the manufacturers glue lines. As an added benefit you can wrap the laminations around the handle.

Bamboo accepts Techni-glue very well so coating the back and belly may stop any loose fibres from lifting.

I live in Rochedale South so if you wish, drop in for a coffee and a chat next time you are up this way.

Daryl.

You have a tidy looking workshop.
"And you must not stick for a groat or twelvepence more than another man would give, if it be a good bow.
For a good bow twice paid for, is better than an ill bow once broken.
[Ascham]

“If a cluttered desk is a sign of a cluttered mind, of what, then, is an empty desk a sign?” [Einstein]

I am old enough to make my own decisions....Just not young enough to remember what I decided!....

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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#9 Post by kimall » Fri Apr 09, 2010 8:35 pm

Good work mate glad to be some inspiration.I found the boo to take a bit of string follow so it will be interesting to see how yours goes.
Cheers KIM

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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#10 Post by ivorycollector » Fri Apr 09, 2010 11:19 pm

Looking good & well done. Cheers.

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perry
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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#11 Post by perry » Sat Apr 10, 2010 6:06 am

Looks like your on the right track ppofandt, welcome to the fold. No need to feel self conscious, plenty of help here. You using the short pieces of timber to check tiller is sound but you can refine this further by using a 4" piece of scrap with a flat base with a small nail through the centre of it barely protruding through the flat base as a gauge. The longer bits are OK in the early stages of tillering but the short piece is a great aid in the fine tillering.

I would leave the belly of this project as flat as possible to better resist compression due to you using a ridgid riser section. The ridgid riser will create a shorter working limb and require a circular tiller. It will shoot light to medium weight arrows best.

Another advantage to a flat belly provided you don't round the edges too much is if the bow does fret or crysal as Greybeard suggested you can patch it with a belly lamination. I recommend you take Greybeard up on his offer, I warn you his workshop is super neat and organized :shock: , bit of a worry actually :D

Personally I am a fan of working handle Selfbows and timber laminate bows as the whole of a working handle bow bends , stores greater energy as a result and it more reliable due to the stress's being more evenly spread through the bow. The D shaped tiller with this type of Bow is a little more challenging. Having said that ridgid handled bows do shoot with less handshock and are a little easier to tiller.

Round the edges slightly belly and back, about as much as a large pea curves is good. Trouble with a flat belly is that they must be perfectly flat or they will crysal / fret. I have no experience with Bamboo floor boards as Selfbows but I have seen plenty of reliable Selfbows made using them with a shallow lenticular cross section though generally with some stringfollow.

As Kim suggested they can follow the string a Boo is not great under compression, so width and as flat a belly as possible are your best bets, perhaps a Pyramid profile 1 1/2" at the fads tapering straight to 3/8"

Having said this I am a little in left field when I say personally I quite like the shooting qualities of Selfbows with a bit of string follow, 2" does not bother me one bit, and have been seen with hunting bows with 4" of string follow. Sure you lose string tension at brace , have less performance but you gain stability, less sensitivity to form errors and greater accuracy as the trade off.

The limbs look as though they have been cut a little shallow for a lenticular belly on this project. Next project why don't you leave the board full depth and tiller a bow with fades that don't flow through a glue line as this a potential issue. Again get the belly flat as possible, shallow lenticular should be fine and a lot less work and perhaps think about a boo lamination to help if an issue arises with the glue line at the fade on this project.

Can you let us know if your contact point of the grip at centre of the stave or is the arrow shelf at centre as this will influence the tiller you require Keep us posted with the tillering process, good Luck , you'll learn heaps and have a blast along the way.

regards Jacko
"To my deep morticication my father once said to me, 'You care for nothing but shooting, dogs and rat catching, and you will be a disgrace to yourself and all your family.' "

- Charles Darwin

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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#12 Post by greybeard » Sat Apr 10, 2010 7:55 pm

perry wrote: I recommend you take Greybeard up on his offer, I warn you his workshop is super neat and organized :shock: , bit of a worry actually :D
Thanks Perry,

I spent most of the day cleaning up a messy workshop :oops: :oops: :oops: now I will have to spend tomorrow cleaning up the mess that I made today cleaning up the mess that was already there. :? :? :? :?

Maybe I need another homebrew? :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink:

Daryl.
"And you must not stick for a groat or twelvepence more than another man would give, if it be a good bow.
For a good bow twice paid for, is better than an ill bow once broken.
[Ascham]

“If a cluttered desk is a sign of a cluttered mind, of what, then, is an empty desk a sign?” [Einstein]

I am old enough to make my own decisions....Just not young enough to remember what I decided!....

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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#13 Post by Gringa Bows » Sat Apr 10, 2010 8:35 pm

And he makes a good cup of coffee too :D ...........................Rod

ppofandt
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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#14 Post by ppofandt » Tue Apr 13, 2010 10:38 am

Thanks everyone for your kind replies.
What poundage are you going for?
To be honest - whatever poundage it pulls when complete :) To say I'm aiming for a specific poundage implies that I know more about the craft than I do.
You could try cutting laminations and tapering them before gluing up. This method reduces the potential for soft spots as well as allowing the laminations to be offset to the manufacturers glue lines. As an added benefit you can wrap the laminations around the handle
That's on my list of future projects. First however, I need to get the basic construction skills ... not perfected, but improved.
I'll also need to build a form (easy enough) and make a lamination grinder (a bit more complex - but I'm always looking for an excuse to buy more tools)

I actually have the materials on-hand now to make a laminated flatbow with glass back/belly. Got all the lams, glass and riser materials. Got a beam to act as a basic flat form. I just need a few more spring clamps and the time to begin construction.
I live in Rochedale South so if you wish, drop in for a coffee and a chat next time you are up this way.
I'd very much like that. I'll send you a PM and see when is most convenient for you.
You have a tidy looking workshop.
Got to have a tidy workshop. For reasons of safety and efficiency. No sane person would let their workshop get untidy... (I cleaned up before taking the photos)
I found the boo to take a bit of string follow
I was expecting that and the brief period that it was strung affirms it. I'll have to keep an eye on that - or but a backing on the bow.
due to you using a ridgid riser section. The ridgid riser will create a shorter working limb
I made the rigid section longer than I'd have liked - mainly to maximise support over the flawed section. But I understand what you're saying.
if the bow does fret or crysal
I understand that the back can splinter but I'm not sure what you mean by 'fret or crystal'. Can you elaborate?
Personally I am a fan of working handle Selfbows and timber laminate bows
I'm not sure I understand that. Working handle Selfbows?
as the whole of a working handle bow bends , stores greater energy as a result
Ya. I understand that ok. Even bend = Store the energy evenly through the limbs. Fewer point failures, longer lifetime (I'm an engineer by training).
so width and as flat a belly as possible are your best bets, perhaps a Pyramid profile 1 1/2" at the fads tapering straight to 3/8"
By pyramid do you mean cross-section or flat xsection with the limbs gently tapering to a point?
With this bow I tapered the width and the thickness down from the original stave size to 15mmwide and 8mm thick at the tips - retaining a flat cross-section though.
Next project why don't you leave the board full depth and tiller a bow with fades that don't flow through a glue line as this a potential issue
Not sure I understand you here. I didn't think any of my fades went through a glue line. Can you elaborate?

Any thoughts on leaving the riser as it is or cutting an arrow shelf in it?

Ciao
Paul.

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Re: First boo-bow. A practice project.

#15 Post by perry » Tue Apr 13, 2010 2:14 pm

if the bow does fret or crysal
Quote: I understand that the back can splinter but I'm not sure what you mean by 'fret or crystal'. Can you elaborate?

A crysal is a minor compression fracture caused by the limb bending to much at that point/ hinging. They are shallow and easily dealt with by relieving timber each side of the fret and leaving it proud so it is not under undue compression. They must be relieved or a Fret will result. Trick is then not to touch this area again during tiller as it has been weakened.

A fret is a major compression fracture and a bad fret can travel vertically through the limb until it reaches the neutral plane and cause bow failure. The neutral plane is the point at which the belly compression and back stretching slide against each other. They are bad news and not as easily dealt with as a crysal. You use the same repair process as a crysal but leave a larger area proud around them. Some folks grind them out and patch them, a how too thread of it's own.
Personally I am a fan of working handle Selfbows and timber laminate bows
Quote: I'm not sure I understand that. Working handle Selfbows?

A working handle Selfbow bends throughout it length, only slightly so through the handle, they should be tillered to come full circle. The classic English longbow is is an example of a work through the handle Selfbow
so width and as flat a belly as possible are your best bets, perhaps a Pyramid profile 1 1/2" at the fads tapering straight to 3/8"
Quote: By pyramid do you mean cross-section or flat xsection with the limbs gently tapering to a point?
With this bow I tapered the width and the thickness down from the original stave size to 15mmwide and 8mm thick at the tips - retaining a flat cross-section though.

Imagine the bow stave laid back up on the workbench. By pyramid design I am talking about the bows width at the widest point of the fadeouts tapering in straight lines to the limb tips not it's depth through to it's belly
Next project why don't you leave the board full depth and tiller a bow with fades that don't flow through a glue line as this a potential issue
Quote: Not sure I understand you here. I didn't think any of my fades went through a glue line. Can you elaborate?

The point where the extremities of the riser meet the belly of the bow is a stress point. I would not be surprised if compression forces the feathered extremities of the riser/ fadeouts to lift at the glue line. If the stave was it's full depth before you trimmed it and had glued a shallower riser piece on it the glue line would have been under little stress and well above any working area of the limb. One little trick if you are working with thinner pieces of timber is to laminate several thin pieces of timber together to form a riser block as horizontally laminated risers handle compression stress better

You have not created an insurmountable problem at all, just a point to be aware of based on me looking at a photograph where it's difficult to get a full appreciation of the likely depth of the working limb as you tiller the bow.

Quote: Any thoughts on leaving the riser as it is or cutting an arrow shelf in it?

No drama's cutting an arrow shelf if you wish but be careful how deep you cut it as you may compromise strength. Again this is based on a photo, you may be fine to go to centre depending on the final draw weight of the bow and how deep and wide the bow is through this area. Generally its best to leave it at least 3/16th from centre with well rounded back and belly edges of the sight window.

Ciao
Paul.[/quote]
"To my deep morticication my father once said to me, 'You care for nothing but shooting, dogs and rat catching, and you will be a disgrace to yourself and all your family.' "

- Charles Darwin

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