Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
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- Benny Nganabbarru
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Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
More scheming...
Are clamps or rubber tyre tube sections just as effective as air hose when glueing-up? What are the relative merits?
Cheers,
Ben
Are clamps or rubber tyre tube sections just as effective as air hose when glueing-up? What are the relative merits?
Cheers,
Ben
It's the great, big, broad land 'way up yonder,
It's the forests where silence has lease;
It's the beauty that thrills me with wonder,
It's the stillness that fills me with peace.
It's the forests where silence has lease;
It's the beauty that thrills me with wonder,
It's the stillness that fills me with peace.
- Gringa Bows
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Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Ben,i like using the inner tube,it works for me but i intend to try the air hose in the future ,i think it would be easier to clamp the bows to the form with the hose................Rod
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
from what i understyand, with an air hose you need to have a two piece form and can only make the same shapped bow each time. i like the tyre tubes as i can change the shape of each bow, make forward and rear handles, change handle lengths, adjust reflex.
...otis...
- Gringa Bows
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Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Good points Otis...............Rod
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
If you are only going to make one or two bows, clamps or rubber tube should suffice.
In a bowmaking workshop situation I use clamps and the glue-up is done in two stages. The client has ten components to glue and assemble and with a pot life of about 45 minutes for the epoxy it is putting too much work at risk to attempt a single glue-up.
For the reasons Otis mentioned I am using clamps. When I settle on two or three designs I will go to the air hose and two piece form.
Daryl.
In a bowmaking workshop situation I use clamps and the glue-up is done in two stages. The client has ten components to glue and assemble and with a pot life of about 45 minutes for the epoxy it is putting too much work at risk to attempt a single glue-up.
For the reasons Otis mentioned I am using clamps. When I settle on two or three designs I will go to the air hose and two piece form.
Daryl.
"And you must not stick for a groat or twelvepence more than another man would give, if it be a good bow.
For a good bow twice paid for, is better than an ill bow once broken. [Ascham]
“If a cluttered desk is a sign of a cluttered mind, of what, then, is an empty desk a sign?” [Einstein]
I am old enough to make my own decisions....Just not young enough to remember what I decided!....
For a good bow twice paid for, is better than an ill bow once broken. [Ascham]
“If a cluttered desk is a sign of a cluttered mind, of what, then, is an empty desk a sign?” [Einstein]
I am old enough to make my own decisions....Just not young enough to remember what I decided!....
- Benny Nganabbarru
- Posts: 1775
- Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 5:14 pm
- Location: Katherine, NT
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Thanks, fellows. Greybeard: Can glueing-up be done in stages including wrapping in black plastic and putting it out in the sun? In other words, once heat-treated and set, can the process be done again for another section of the bow? In yet more "other words", can an already glued and set bow go through the process again without detriment or not? I should learn to be succinct.
It's the great, big, broad land 'way up yonder,
It's the forests where silence has lease;
It's the beauty that thrills me with wonder,
It's the stillness that fills me with peace.
It's the forests where silence has lease;
It's the beauty that thrills me with wonder,
It's the stillness that fills me with peace.
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Hi Ben,
The first glue-up [which incorporates the back glass, two laminations and handle] are left clamped up overnight on the workbench.
The following day the clamps and pressure strips can be removed. A final ‘feathering’ can be done to the fadeouts if needed and the belly lamination and glass is then glued on, clamped and left overnight on the work bench.
Next day the bow can be ‘roughed’ out and tip overlays added.
Generally the bow has had 72 hours for the two pack epoxy to air cure before you start loading up the limbs.
I have only ever used ambient temperature to cure Techniglue and have not experienced any problems. In summer my workshop may reach 35 or more degrees. I believe there may be applications where an elevated temperature could improve the bond strength of some two pack epoxies.
Daryl.
The first glue-up [which incorporates the back glass, two laminations and handle] are left clamped up overnight on the workbench.
The following day the clamps and pressure strips can be removed. A final ‘feathering’ can be done to the fadeouts if needed and the belly lamination and glass is then glued on, clamped and left overnight on the work bench.
Next day the bow can be ‘roughed’ out and tip overlays added.
Generally the bow has had 72 hours for the two pack epoxy to air cure before you start loading up the limbs.
I have only ever used ambient temperature to cure Techniglue and have not experienced any problems. In summer my workshop may reach 35 or more degrees. I believe there may be applications where an elevated temperature could improve the bond strength of some two pack epoxies.
Daryl.
"And you must not stick for a groat or twelvepence more than another man would give, if it be a good bow.
For a good bow twice paid for, is better than an ill bow once broken. [Ascham]
“If a cluttered desk is a sign of a cluttered mind, of what, then, is an empty desk a sign?” [Einstein]
I am old enough to make my own decisions....Just not young enough to remember what I decided!....
For a good bow twice paid for, is better than an ill bow once broken. [Ascham]
“If a cluttered desk is a sign of a cluttered mind, of what, then, is an empty desk a sign?” [Einstein]
I am old enough to make my own decisions....Just not young enough to remember what I decided!....
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
grey beard
do you just wipe the excess glue that squeezes out from infront of the fade outs and then when it cures give it a light scrape? so iam not wasting to much glue, what would i measure out for a 72" longbow 1 1/12" wide for the back glass, two lams and riser? Whats the best form for using clamps and tyre tubes ( dimensions ) and configurations? sorry for all the questions. I would like to get it right the first time. Its been raining and very humid so iam waiting for the weather to improve before i glue up and reading about doing it in stages sounds like a go idea to me.
thanks ross
do you just wipe the excess glue that squeezes out from infront of the fade outs and then when it cures give it a light scrape? so iam not wasting to much glue, what would i measure out for a 72" longbow 1 1/12" wide for the back glass, two lams and riser? Whats the best form for using clamps and tyre tubes ( dimensions ) and configurations? sorry for all the questions. I would like to get it right the first time. Its been raining and very humid so iam waiting for the weather to improve before i glue up and reading about doing it in stages sounds like a go idea to me.
thanks ross
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Where do you source your inner tubes rom? Do you buy cheap ones from a store, or do you raid the bins of bicycle and car repair places?
If I'm using Titebond wood glue for bamboo board selfbows wrapped in inner tubes, will the tubing be able to be recycled, or do you need to cut/scrape the tubes off so you're always replacing the tubing?
The only 2-layer stave I've made so far used Titebond II and a whole heap of plastic springy clamps, not the screw style. So far it's held together after several hundred shots and hasn't shown any glue voids.
If I'm using Titebond wood glue for bamboo board selfbows wrapped in inner tubes, will the tubing be able to be recycled, or do you need to cut/scrape the tubes off so you're always replacing the tubing?
The only 2-layer stave I've made so far used Titebond II and a whole heap of plastic springy clamps, not the screw style. So far it's held together after several hundred shots and hasn't shown any glue voids.
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
go to a bob janes or other car/truck tyre joint and get old ones with punctures in them for free. i don't use bicycle tubes.
...otis...
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Afternoon Kevin
2. The plastic sping clamps can work well - in some ways I like them as they do not come loose.
3. You only get to see the glue voids when it comes apart.
1. If you do not want your rubber strips (bands) sticking to the bow as you glue it up put a layer of cling wrap over it before you apply the rubber strips (bands).Mububban wrote:If I'm using Titebond wood glue for bamboo board selfbows wrapped in inner tubes, will the tubing be able to be recycled, or do you need to cut/scrape the tubes off so you're always replacing the tubing?
The only 2-layer stave I've made so far used Titebond II and a whole heap of plastic springy clamps, not the screw style. So far it's held together after several hundred shots and hasn't shown any glue voids.
2. The plastic sping clamps can work well - in some ways I like them as they do not come loose.
3. You only get to see the glue voids when it comes apart.
Grahame.
Shoot a Selfbow, embrace Wood Arrows, discover Vintage, be a Trendsetter.
"Unfortunately, the equating of simplicity with truth doesn't often work in real life. It doesn't often work in science, either." Dr Len Fisher.
Shoot a Selfbow, embrace Wood Arrows, discover Vintage, be a Trendsetter.
"Unfortunately, the equating of simplicity with truth doesn't often work in real life. It doesn't often work in science, either." Dr Len Fisher.
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Going to throw my 2 cents in for you.
I use 1/2" x 3" rubber bands that I buy in bulk. After I use them (I use a heat bow) I discard them. They are inexpensive and I can get a lot of pressure from them.
I use 1/2" x 3" rubber bands that I buy in bulk. After I use them (I use a heat bow) I discard them. They are inexpensive and I can get a lot of pressure from them.
- Stickbow Hunter
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Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
I used clamps initially but now I much prefer the air hose system. The air hose gives good even gluing pressure and is easier than using clamps.
I wouldn't consider doing glue-up of a wood/glass composite bow in stages because IMO it makes the job more difficult - contamination of wood gluing surfaces being of major concern. I use Smooth-On and it has a good pot life which allows plenty of time for glue-up.
Jeff
I wouldn't consider doing glue-up of a wood/glass composite bow in stages because IMO it makes the job more difficult - contamination of wood gluing surfaces being of major concern. I use Smooth-On and it has a good pot life which allows plenty of time for glue-up.
Jeff
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Hey Jeff I see on some build alongs when using the air hose (which i did) they put 20lb in first for 5 min, then 40lb for another 5 min and finish with 60lb all up. The theory being it allows time for the air bubbles if any to pass to the side and not get trapped.
Silly me on my first bow used clear glass and yes had a few small bubbles trapped and wondered if i used the above method I would of had a bubble free bow.
But next time will youse colour glass which should also fix the problem.He He.
Do you think adding the air pressure slowly would help?
Thanks Wayno
Silly me on my first bow used clear glass and yes had a few small bubbles trapped and wondered if i used the above method I would of had a bubble free bow.
But next time will youse colour glass which should also fix the problem.He He.
Do you think adding the air pressure slowly would help?
Thanks Wayno
Justastik Arrow Craft, Its all about the Wood.
- Stickbow Hunter
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Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Wayno,Do you think adding the air pressure slowly would help?
Yes. I only put around 10 pound of air pressure in to start with and leave it a few minutes and then increase poundage to 15 - 20 pound for a further few minutes and then pump up to the pressure I want which is around 65 pound. I haven't had any problems with air bubles myself but I have seen them in other bows.
Jeff
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
If i was using clear glass on wood and clamps would it be likely that i would have air bubbles?
Cheers, Toby
- Stickbow Hunter
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Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Toby,
If you just put light pressure on the lams with the clamps first and then go along each clamp and make them tigher I don't see why you should have problems with air bubbles. I used clamps back in the 1980's and early 1990's and didn't have problems with air bubbles.
Jeff
If you just put light pressure on the lams with the clamps first and then go along each clamp and make them tigher I don't see why you should have problems with air bubbles. I used clamps back in the 1980's and early 1990's and didn't have problems with air bubbles.
Jeff
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Ok thats good. How many clamps should i use, i was thinking around 10-15.
Cheers, Toby
- Stickbow Hunter
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Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
More the better IMO and make sure you have a good thick pressure strip between the glass and clamps to help distribute a more even pressure. If you don't your bow limbs will have light indents wherever your clamps were positioned.
Jeff
Jeff
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Hi Toby,
My clamp spacing is around 2 1/2". I use a pressure strip made up of one 1.5 mm hardwood strip, a strip of 6mm high density rubber and a strip of three ply. It may not be fancy but it works.
Daryl.
My clamp spacing is around 2 1/2". I use a pressure strip made up of one 1.5 mm hardwood strip, a strip of 6mm high density rubber and a strip of three ply. It may not be fancy but it works.
Daryl.
Last edited by greybeard on Tue Nov 08, 2011 12:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"And you must not stick for a groat or twelvepence more than another man would give, if it be a good bow.
For a good bow twice paid for, is better than an ill bow once broken. [Ascham]
“If a cluttered desk is a sign of a cluttered mind, of what, then, is an empty desk a sign?” [Einstein]
I am old enough to make my own decisions....Just not young enough to remember what I decided!....
For a good bow twice paid for, is better than an ill bow once broken. [Ascham]
“If a cluttered desk is a sign of a cluttered mind, of what, then, is an empty desk a sign?” [Einstein]
I am old enough to make my own decisions....Just not young enough to remember what I decided!....
Re: Glueing-up: Air hose or clamps or tyre tubes?
Good Morning
In the Yumi photo below there are about 50 - but that is a bit more than normal.
If you look at the photo in Greybeards post above there are around 25 clamps on that bow.pdccr wrote:Ok thats good. How many clamps should i use, i was thinking around 10-15.
In the Yumi photo below there are about 50 - but that is a bit more than normal.
Grahame.
Shoot a Selfbow, embrace Wood Arrows, discover Vintage, be a Trendsetter.
"Unfortunately, the equating of simplicity with truth doesn't often work in real life. It doesn't often work in science, either." Dr Len Fisher.
Shoot a Selfbow, embrace Wood Arrows, discover Vintage, be a Trendsetter.
"Unfortunately, the equating of simplicity with truth doesn't often work in real life. It doesn't often work in science, either." Dr Len Fisher.