Reflex Deflex

[longbow steve]

This is a small Indian style bow that I made for a mate. Was a fun exercise and shoots with surprising accuracy.
35# @20" American White Ash 44" NTN

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[Stickbow Hunter]

Well done Steve, looks good. Those little short draw bows feel very strange to shoot and would take a bit of getting used to I think.

Jeff

[Bandsaw]

Its a gorgeous bow mate. Would love to read the steps you took to make it.

[Gringa Bows]

Great job on the bow Steve.

[longbow steve]

Well done Steve, looks good. Those little short draw bows feel very strange to shoot and would take a bit of getting used to I think.

Jeff

The hardest thing is keeping your draw short

Its a gorgeous bow mate. Would love to read the steps you took to make it.

Thanks Bandsaw, I took some photos of the process incase I had to make another so I may do a write up. The bow is laminated if that helps to understand the shape?

Great job on the bow Steve.

Thanks rod

[UPTHETOP]

C' mon Steve pull it back mate.

Cheers Wayno

[Guy Layton]

Steve,

The bow looks good mate...!

The bloke you made the bow for must be a funny looking character....! His arms must each be only 500mm long....!!

Cheers Guy

[longbow steve]

Steve,

The bow looks good mate...!

The bloke you made the bow for must be a funny looking character....! His arms must each be only 500mm long....!!

Cheers Guy

You can suffer the Wrath alone for that one

[Hamish]

Hi Steve, That's great!

When you first told me about this bow, you just said it was ash, so I was expecting to see another straight ash longbow like the last one you made(which is also pretty nifty). So I am am excited and impressed to see a more adventurous design. Me likey. Looking forward to seeing what you do next.

Hamish

[Jon des Bois]

Hey Steve,

Something about this bow really appeals to me, you just don't see enough of these on the range.

Just curious, does it have a thickness taper, or are the limbs the same thickness throughout?


Cheers, Jon

[longbow steve]

Hi Jon, Yes it has .002" taper and a 14" wedge in the handle section to thicken it slightly. Note the handle straightens out at full draw.
I like the bow and have plans for another

[longbow steve]

Hi Steve, That's great!

When you first told me about this bow, you just said it was ash, so I was expecting to see another straight ash longbow like the last one you made(which is also pretty nifty). So I am am excited and impressed to see a more adventurous design. Me likey. Looking forward to seeing what you do next.

Hamish

Thanks Hamish

[Dennis La Varenne]

Steve,

Very well done!

I have made several of these little bows too and they are fascinating to make and shoot. Mine were of the reflex-deflex configuration like yours, but in the style of Plains Indian bows, being a bit narrower at the flare (about 1 1/4 inches and with fairly wide tips of around 5/8 inch but with a waisted handle like yours. I steam bent the stave into about 7 inches of reflex, let it cool well and then deflexed the outer half of each limb.

Unlike yours, the model I used did not have the slight static reflex in the nock area.

Mine were all made from varying grades of Osage and went as heavy as 70lbs at 23 inchs which was a monster and almost impossible for me to draw. It was made for a mate who was into Plains Indian stuff.

However, mine were a tad longer than yours, usually at around 50 inches overall with a pin nock on the upper limb (to which I tied some horse tail hair courtesy of my mate's horses) and bilateral nocks on the lower limb.

The other aspect of the designs I based my bows on (one of the northern tribes) had a shorter lower limb which gave them a slight Yumi appearance, but was remarkable in that it seemed to reduce string pinch more than one would have thought in such a short bow.

Shooting them gave a whole new meaning to the meaning of instinctive shooting, being more like the feeling of shooting from the hip. When I got the hang of the short draw effect on my back muscles and mostly arm muscles, I was able to shoot pretty accurately by drawing and loosing with a floating 'anchor' in line with the 'pap' as they used to say in old England. It really had the feeling of pointing my bowhand index finger at the mark.

Not good for long shots though.

I found them surprisingly undifficult to make, the most work going into the bending.

[longbow steve]

Very interesting Dennis, I wasn't that happy with the braced and drawn profile of this one as to me it looks more Asiatic but the next on will look more authentic.
I dont suppose you would have photos of the ones you made?
Can you recommend the best books to read on short indian bows?
Thanks Steve

[Dennis La Varenne]

Steve,
Your little bow looks more akin to the sinew backed Plains bows which commonly had bellies of some kind of deer antler and sometimes (preferably) Bighorn sheep horn when it could be had. When drawn however, the outer reflex was practically gone.

The selfwood bows usually did not have the short outer reflexes; being formed by first creating a huge reflex in the middle of the bow and then deflexing the outer limb to straight. They were not deflexed past straight toward the belly on any of the artifacts which I have seen pictures of.

When drawn, the seflwood bows bent into the very pronounced shape of the bowl of the letter 'D', beloved of the English longbow shooter. I guess those with short little outer tip reflexes had them to keep their strings on, but that is a guess, because they weren't functioning reflexes.

The styles I built had a single side-nock on the upper limb and bilateral nocks on the lower limb. The strings were flemish twisted for their entire length without a loop being formed and were close to twice the length of the bow. The upper loop was a slip-knot formed by tying one end into a loop and feeding the remainder of the string through it.

Allowing enough length to brace the bow (very low indeed usually) the lower loop was a variant of the timber hitch with the remainder of the string wound back up along the lower limb above the nock with its knotted end tucked under the last loop and pulled tight.

This provided a string which could be continuously fed along the bow as the upper loop frayed from wear and was cut off, after which a new loop was formed and the remainder fed along and tied as previously. Quite clever in its simplicity really.

The books I sourced on the subject were Jim Hamm's book on Native American Bows and Arrows, and his and Steve Allely's joint efforts to produce the two volumes so far of the Encyclopaediae of Native American Bows and Arrows. There is one on the East Coast tribes and one on the Plains tribes. They are yet to produce one on the West Coast tribes.

The other source is the large amount of material in the Traditional Bowyer's Bibles.

[stringnstik]

Damit Steve I'm never going to catch up to you if you keep making bows while Im still building my shed
top effort again, crys out for some nice pyrographic work on the limbs tho

[longbow steve]

Thanks for the info Dennis, I might order the books you have mentioned and have a go with some short staves i have.

Damit Steve I'm never going to catch up to you if you keep making bows while Im still building my shed
top effort again, crys out for some nice pyrographic work on the limbs tho

Thanks Mark, Yeah it would be good to have artwork on the back. There is a fantastic Pyrographer up here that I have often wanted to ask for some art on a lamination to go under clear glass. I look forward to seeing your work when you get a shed . steve

[Dennis La Varenne]

Steven,

I have some pictures of a few of my Plains bows at home, but I am at Jeff's on holidays presently. I will post them when I get home.

[looseplucker]

Jim Hamm's book is a cracker. I also have one by Douglas Spotted Eagle - can't remember the title at the moment but I will bring them up to the Expo and show you.

Btw - what is the width from flares to tips, if I may be so bold.

Also, like the handgrip - that fibre looks familiar

[longbow steve]

Jim Hamm's book is a cracker. I also have one by Douglas Spotted Eagle - can't remember the title at the moment but I will bring them up to the Expo and show you.

Btw - what is the width from flares to tips, if I may be so bold.

Also, like the handgrip - that fibre looks familiar

Hi John, 50mm at the flares and 20mm at the nocks.
Thanks, I would love a flick through the books you have.
The handle wrap is Hemp fibre rather than fancy imported linen . I didn't note what the wrap was made of incase the new owner tried to smoke it, it is impregnated with Minwax oil and would make him sick .

[hazard]

It looks great I reckon a largr scale one would perform quite well too!

[Primitive Boy]

This is bit of a Necro-post (a post that could be considered spamming due to the current topics age), but that bow looks awesome

it looks similiar to an Assyrian/Scythian cavalary bow, only a bit longer.

[longbow steve]

Thanks Primitive Boy, the thread isn't that old . It is a good simple bow to make when you have a bit of laminating ability under your belt.

[Primitive Boy]

Haha, either way, its a lovely bow

I'm John btw, I couldn't think of a better username thingy, John was taken

[longbow steve]

Nice to meet you John. Good to see a young man interested in selfbows, you're a rarity

[Primitive Boy]

Haha, thanks mate, i'm very young But I just think self-bows are the best