Wet weather arrows..?

[kimall]

As we have had weeks of rain now I decided today to have a play to see if I could make a rain proof arrow that shoots well from the longbow.I shoot carbons for hunting so started with a bare shaft I had and played with some vane combos and shaft length to get a set up that would shoot as well as the feathered arrows I have.I found that shooting with the vanes cock vane out the bottom vane would bounce off the shelf and upset the arrow in flight.However if the arrow was turned cock vane in the arrow flight was perfect.The arrow was quieter in flight than wet feathers I was using as a test comparison and at 30 meters the arrow with vanes was about 6 inches higher at point of impact.I ended up with 3 four inch vanes and can see heaps of advantages to using vanes.Cost for one thing and knowing that if the weather turns bad mid hunting trip my gear wont be affected.I finished by shooting some arrows with b/heads in the rain this afternoon with feathers and vanes and the vanes performed so much better.I think the probs people have is that they just try putting vanes on their normal arrows and dont build new arrows to suit the vanes from scratch.
I know most will say" I only shoot woods and feathers bla bla bla but for those that put hunting results before the romance of trad archery then it may be worth a look.
Cheers KIM

[longbowinfected]

I use 4 feathered fletches two inches long 8 mm high and tied on to my bamboo arrows set on wraps. They do not get heavy or flatten out and shoot the same wet, wind or dry. I use a Saunders plastic all weather tab and practice after immersing my tab, drawing hand and the fletches in water each shot. Some of my boo arrows have screw in adapters for blunts and broadheads. Does not matter whether it is target or hunting you can be just as consistently accurate even whilst living the woods dream. Guess you could do the same with carbons if that floats your boat Kim. I find it works equally well on all species.

Kev

[g_r]

I simply spray my feathers with silicone for wet weather. Makes em water repellent and even in heavy down pours they stay as they should. After about two weeks (5-6 shooting sessions) i have to respray becuase the silicone gets away after some impacts. But its cheap and easy to do.

[Dennis La Varenne]

I know most will say" I only shoot woods and feathers bla bla bla but for those that put hunting results before the romance of trad archery then it may be worth a look.

Kim, that is a rather undeservedly and unnecessarily rude comment to those on Ozbow you sneer at for using wood and feathers. There is nothing romantic about wood and feather arrows. They have killed efficiently for many many thousands of years just as efficiently as syntharrows. No goat or pig I have shot has yet to complain of a feeling inadequately killed by a wood arrow.

What is your beef with a comment like that?? You could simply have not mentioned it without losing anything from the principle of wet weather arrows. What is your reason???

[matt61]

Hi Kimall
I made up arrows with one feather and two vanes, years ago and hunted and shot target with them
and they shot quite well.The feather ran over the shelf and I set the other hen vane so it didn't touch
the riser on the way thru.
cheers
Matt

[kerrille]

i agree with dennis been shooting woods for years and havent noticed any difference, when on a couple of occasions i was given allys to use, out to 30mtrs they all shoot the same

...nev...

[Gene-o]

Hey Kim, I played with some vanes on my arras with a 12 o'clock cock flight using 3 5inch vanes but they were abit old and hard, flew like s##t. Your on the money there with your set up Cheers mate I will give it a go (could have used some wet wheather arrows last Easter)


Geneo

[kimall]

Dennis my sneer is not at any person but in the attitude I get all the time at shoots and yes even on here that trad bows should be shot with wood arrows and feathers or it is not trad.I have nothing against people shooting wood arrows or any other material that works for them as shooting ANY arrow is still archery but this is def not the common trend among trad shooters and if you dont see this I dont believe you are being truly realistic.If I got upset as quick as you seem to have over that comment that was HALF toung in cheek anyway then I would leave every shoot cranky when people try to belittle me for NOT shooting wood arrows.
For the sake of the site and to help foster the spirit that I believe it represents I will apolagise to anyone that feels I attacked them personaly my typing skills do at times let me down and I think the conversation would go differantly face to face.
My main point was has anyone that may want to try a wet arrow set up done so from scratch instead of just putting vanes on their normal feathered arrows.
Cheers KIM

[ed]

Must be an oil of some sort that can be used on feathers, after all it works for ducks...

[g_r]

GermanWHippet uses natural goose feathers, he says they are waterrepellent right away and he has no Problems with rain. Perhaps hell jump in and can say more.

[ed]

Dennis my sneer is not at any person but in the attitude I get all the time at shoots and yes even on here that trad bows should be shot with wood arrows and feathers or it is not trad.

Well Kim I agree - it is not as "trad" as shooting wood arrows. Nor is using a laminated fibreglass bow as "trad" as using a selfbow. BUT it is still archery! and without wheels at that!

I used carbons for nearly two years and got stick from the wheelies for using a longbow, when I started using woods it really dumbfounded them. If you straighten arrows in front of wheelies you can see their eyes almost roll back into their head

In the past I got grief from certain people saying trad people can't hit anything etc - some on this site too and my advice is chill on the snide comments, it doesn't make anything better and it should really only be a gentlemanly rivalry of style...

[kimall]

I know we used to use stuff for dry fly fishing called gink I think it was and it came from ducks glands and worked great but would be costly in larger quantaties I would think and would need to be reapplied.I guess I could also have a set of arrows just for hunting that had been sprayed so it would not wear off and I have never tried the silicone spray to see how affective it would be.I have been giving it some thought and feel that there might be other pros also.
From experience shooting game with compounds with vanes the vanes often would stop at the skin stopping the arrow going all the way through and I wonder if having the arrow poking right through but still in the wound might that stop the wound closing over with tissue and skin when the animal runs.? I am just putting that out for comment not sure either way yet really.The other thing annoying with feathers is after passing through the blood and gore can take some getting off to get the arrow back to hunting condition while in the field and vanes can be cleaned with a bit of a quick wash if they get messy.
I will do up a doz with vanes when I get some and give them a test for a year or so.I still have a floor board bow I made shooting handmade woods with stone heads and hand cut turkey feathers to play with when the moos takes me.
Cheers KIM

[Gene-o]

Well said Kim. Recon I've put my fair share of s##t on ya about carbon arrows hey Pretty sure we left on a hand shake and a laugh. Maybe others could do the same or better still... take a joke!


Recurve/wood arrows. Geneo

[Dennis La Varenne]

Kim,

By way of explanation, perhaps those having a go at your use of carbons are doing the same as you - tongue in cheek-wise. Personally, I couldn't care less what equipment you use or why you use it if it gets the results you desire. But, having been the butt of ridicule yourself as you say, there is no need to dish it out to others and play the same game. None of us has to like other's equipment, but everyone has the right to use it for their own reasons and not have to justify that to anyone any more than you do.

One only has to justify one's equipment preferences if they state that theirs works and that of others does not, in which case, it is fair and reasonable to require why.

There is a clear advantage in syntharrows in that they do not have to be treated with the same levels of care to obtain a similar result. Wood arrows require much more care. That is just a fact of life which we wood arrow afficianados are prepared to live with. Never have I disparaged any person who prefers syntharrows and can find no reason why I would.

My concern is the preservation of our archery heritage and its ancient skills in the manufacture of its equipment. I don't like to see it undermined as many latter-day 'traditionalists' seem to want to do by fiddling with traditional terminology and bow designs. But I have no problem at all with those who prefer more modern equipment for its own sake or for any particular benefit it may confer.

I would be the first to defend your choice. That is why I found your comment so disturbing. That is all. Anyway - on with the waterproofing of feathers.

Regards,

[perry]

I am not a great fan of any of the commercially available coatings on feathers or the old hairspray remedy. I havve found Silicon spray does not sludge up the barbules on the feathers and is better than most.

I have success with wet weather and arrows by paying great attention to Bow Tuning and finding the correct spine arrows. Properly spined target arrows will fly true from a tuned bow even with wet flattened feathers. With Broadheads though you are stuck and have little option but to use Vanes. I guess you could compromise and switch to a multibladed broadhead like an MA3

I like to mix a penetrating finish of 1 part Gum Turpentine, I part boiled Linseed Oil and 1 part Feast Watson high gloss lacquer. I wipe on 6 or 7 coats and rub the shafts over with 0000 steel wool between coats. Each coat is dry inside 1/2 an hour. With this sealer I have found arrows that I have lost weeks and weeks earlier on field coarses in perfect condition. I use the same finish on most of the Selfbows I've made and never had any issue's with water.

I think that the feathers we purchase today are far inferior to those that where available in the 70's and 80's. Once you could wash off feathers that where gunked up with blood while still wet , allow to dry and then steam back into shape once in camp. No day's once they have been gunked up I refletch.

regards Jacko

[UPTHETOP]

Hey Kim a lot of fellas up at Tully (rain capital of AUS ) youse some vains as well. Oftn hunting in the rain to boot you just cant escape it up that way. You can pick these fellas as nearly all there bows contain the tooth brush rest on there riser for vain clearence of the shelf.
I guess if you lived in the rain capital of Aus you would have to come up with different confiquirations to be able just to shoot Trad gear when it rains most of the time.
I seen this a lot in NZ as well where it rains a lot as well on the South Island.

Being an old fly man myself I ofetn use the gink as well mate.

Cheers Wayno

[Chase N. Nocks]

The old tooth brush arrow rest. That brings back some memories.

Wayne what is GINK?

Not to worry mate I just reread Kim post

Cheers
Troy

[ed]

I am still with Perry on this one - bare shaft your arrows well and your fletching is not so important, get it right and you wonder sometimes why you put it on...

[Rob DiStefano]

though i have no problem bareshafting arrows to fly well, i still want enuf fletching to insure that a not-so-good release can get corrected. out in the bush - cold muscles, cold air, hot and sticky, bad shooting position, whatever nastiness abounds - all of that and tons more can mess up a well intentioned release. if i err on dropping the string, my shafts fletchings will right the bugger up quick.

i did a 5 minute running water test with shafts fletched with process feathers and natural feathers (goose) ... which fletch would you wanna take hunting?


now all my arras sport natural turkey or goose. goose feathers are dark and can be hard to track during flight, so quite often i use faux fur tracers ...

[Benny Nganabbarru]

G'day Rob,

I reckon your arrows would make me sneeze if I shot them, and that wouldn't be pretty! Just ask poor Tony!

Cheers,

Ben

[Rob DiStefano]

G'day Rob,

I reckon your arrows would make me sneeze if I shot them, and that wouldn't be pretty! Just ask poor Tony!

Cheers,

Ben

hey ben,

what you been up to?

waiting on a coupla longbows - hill big5 and a miller ol' tom ... the hill will arrive in time the spring hog hunt down in the carolinas, yea!

cheers,
rob.

[wishsong]

Rob,
are those tracers the commercial ones or home made. I'm a fan of seeing my arrows in flight but even bigger fan of keeping my arrows flying well regardless of weather... i treat them and at the first sign of inclement weather opt for an Arrowmaster or Bower side quiver w/fletch cover over my back or bow quiver.
Still , I have a bunch of goose feathers that I'll use soon, either on bright wraps over carbons or might give some tracer a go on a couple of woodies. Easy to install ?
I also got sent a bunch of natural barred feathers from a guy in the states ... you might know him...his name is ..err... Rob Di S ...

B

[Rob DiStefano]

Rob,
are those tracers the commercial ones or home made. I'm a fan of seeing my arrows in flight but even bigger fan of keeping my arrows flying well regardless of weather... i treat them and at the first sign of inclement weather opt for an Arrowmaster or Bower side quiver w/fletch cover over my back or bow quiver.
Still , I have a bunch of goose feathers that I'll use soon, either on bright wraps over carbons or might give some tracer a go on a couple of woodies. Easy to install ?
I also got sent a bunch of natural barred feathers from a guy in the states ... you might know him...his name is ..err... Rob Di S ...

B

g'day (evening?) ben,

the tracers i've been using come from 3rivers and are faux rabbit strips with sticky backs, very easy to use and they stay put in nasty weather. i use a variety of quivers, some efa ultra lites bow types, but mostly prefer either a safari tuff duiker model stalker (super lightweight) or a jack bowers all leather stalker - all these arrow quiver thingys have separate fletch covers. i did a buncha testing with natural feathers from canada goose and turks, and they're the only way to go for me as they are terrifically water resistant as compared to commercial feathers that are stripped of the bird's natural oils during processing.

cheers,
robbo!

me and the duiker at a 3d event ...

[wishsong]

Thanks...
Out of all my quivers , and years of alternating between back quivers and bow quivers [ dislike the balance w/bow quivers] I have grown to prefer the Side stalker [ the bigger/stiffer version] . Love the way it lays across my back, lets me wear a backpack etc.

I did change over the fletch cover thingy to one more substantial and carry a longer [ approx 12" by 6" ] zip lock bag to put over the fletches but under the Fletch cover if it is really ******* down.
Works a treat.